"ESLa****te" <esla****te@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
news:<ZgBbc.8973$NL4.7150@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>...
> > ...
> > NATO is anti-Russian. That's why all of Russia's neighbours mean to
> > join. All of Russia's neighbours are anti-Russian. There may be
> > reasons for this, produced over the centuries.
> > Russia doesn't join.
>
> Oh boy! Here we go again with the same old Cold War and "Russia is the
enemy
> of NATO" outdated, Cold War stereotypical, mindless thinking...ho
-hum!!!
> Another mindless recital of Lord Ismay too on the way?!
Almost 400 years of on again off again occupation can do that to you.
I agree with Gintas' sentiment. Who are you to tell us how we should
feel today ?
Making sure one doesnt relive history is hardly a mindless exercize.
>
> So - once again - NO - NATO is not anti-Russian and was not intended to
be
> anti-Russian. It was anti-Soviet communism. Does the Soviet Union still
> exist? Nope!
NATO wasnt anti soviet communism. NATO wasnt formed to battle
ideology. NATO was formed to counter the spread of soviet aggression
and repression - executed via the application of military might. The
soviet response was the Warsaw Pact - also hardly an ideological
entity...
>
> Not only do scholars like Ira Straus and Mark Kramer believe that Russia
> belongs in NATO, but Kramer states that there is no reason to keep
Russia
> out of NATO when it qualifies for member****p. Kramer states that NATO
should
> work with a willing Russian government for NATO member****p :
The key here being "when russia qualifies". I believe you'll find a
significant number of scholars who can effectively argue that Russia
will likely never qualify for NATO member****p.
>
> We should work with Russia to overcome the penchant for imperialism and
the
> notion of having dominating its neighbors. Also, the psychological
legacy of
> the centuries old "Mongol yoke" needs to be overcome...
The statement "work with Russia to overcome" implies that its penchant
for imperialism and dominating of neighbors still exists.
It in fact does and I'm sure a good number of posters here can point
out various instances where Russia continues to exert pressure (not
necessarily military in nature) on its neighbors to influence internal
economic and political conditions to this day.
>
> I have great faith that NATO can help Russians to overcome these
> tendencies...
Faith is good. Reality is that NATO wont ever change anyones nature or
outlook in the way you hope.
>
> Also, the Alliance and Russia are working together to fight
international
> terrorism. If there are groups that go around blowing up hospitals and
> taking whole theaters hostage that are full of innocent people - that
is
> terrorism! Our Alliance is working with Russia to help fight the scourge
of
> terrorism, and this IS im****tant to help keep weapons of mass
destruction
> out of the hands of terrorists..!
Hehe... And where exactly would you go in the world if you were in the
market to buy such arms ? Hint...RPG and AK's arent being manufactured
in Milwaukee.
>
> THE COLD WAR IS OVER DAMNIT!!!
Easy Cartman... The cold war isnt over. It's just taken on a new form.
Broader more diverse list of "enemies".
>
> The Cold War is long over and NATO is no longer a "Cold War alliance."
To
> state that the "Cold War is good" is to remain in locked in the box of
the
> Cold War mentality. You cannot honestly be pro-NATO and following
CURRENT
> events and doings of NATO too seriously say that! To believe that the
Cold
> War is still going on is to state that our NATO Alliance IS irrelevant -
--
> as the Cold War has been over for will over a decade.
No, I think if the cold war was truly over then the NATO alliance
would be irrelevant. The nations that joined recently didnt do so that
they could sew those cool blue patches on their uniforms. These
nations joined because NATO offers a security alliance that better
positions them against traditional threats. Otherwise, why join ?
>
> If you are pro-NATO you cannot still have the "Cold War NATO" mentality,
as
> then it follows that NATO is irrelevant, as the Cold War IS OVER and the
> "Soviet Russia enemy" no longer exists!!! You also deny that our NATO
> Alliance has adapted and you religate it to the Cold War role forever..!
>
> Our NATO Alliance has adapted for the new threats, not from Russia, but
from
> terrorism.
> The "Cold War NATO" no longer exists!!!
Thats different. The cold war centric NATO doesnt truly exist as it
once did. But NATO's need to evolve and tranform to some degree does
not mean that traditional sources of military threat and
destabilization have miraculously disappeared as you seem to believe.
Vidas
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