Re: The History of Latvia

On May 2, 10:39=A0pm, Vladimir Makarenko <vmak...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
> The Black Monk wrote:
> > On May 1, 2:36 pm, P=E7teris Cedri=F2=F0 (Peteris Cedrins)
> > <cedr...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
> >> On 1 Maijs, 18:19, MTRP(tm) <Mir.Topol...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
>
> >>> It does. Still earlier Mr Latvia licked German and both Bol**** and
> >>> Nazi *****. That's what your cartoon was all about and why I asked
> >>> about Mr Latvia's new white massa. Even his ex-Prezidentsha was
> >>> im****ted from massa's (Canadian) harem ...
> >> I guess you don't realize how comments like this weaken your case to
> >> the point of absurdity? Tell me, please, how Latvia _ever_ licked
> >> German ass. Latvia even declared war on Germany, in November 1919.
>
> >> Licked Bol****e ass? You should watch the cartoon again -- it must
have
> >> been too subtle for you. Letts were quite Bolshevik, yes -- for good
> >> reason.
>
> > Claiming someone as being pro-Bolshevik "for good reason" is
> > comparable to claiming someone is a Nazi, or a child molestor, or a
> > murderer "for good reason."
>
> To say something like that is equivalent to believe in the original sin
> - =A0and see no causality in the events.

Causality is quite clear.  I object to Peteris' implication that
causation equals justification.

> First, Bolsheviks neither Nazis came out of Blue - people were pushed in
> this dark corner.

Sure.  And?  It makes their crimes okay?  Latvian Red Rifles pu****ng
Bolshevism on the Russian people weren't such bad guys, because the
czars had used them as cannon fodder?  That makes statues to those
monsters acceptable?

> Secondly, neither Bolsheviks nor Nazis in the
> beginning told people what is expecting them in the end of the tunnel.
> And the last - if you inquire in the psychiatric history of child
> molesters you will find that they were molested themselves. Like father
> like son.

While victims of child abuse are more likely than non-victims to
become abusers themselves, the majority of victims do not do so.  And
some perpetrators were never abused.

> So, despite I think that Cedrins at least sometimes - expresses himself
> - if not thinks like neocon, he has a point here - Latvians did have a
> very good reason to make a deal with Bolsheviks, mabe be not well
> thought reasoning, but who did one? Half of the world was on fire.

You are well aware that Latvian involvement in the Bolshevik
revolution went much deeper than merely making a deal.  The revolution
would have been stillborn without Latvian participation.

regards,

BM


> Otherwise what you say is another accusation which sounds like "Original
> Sin". Which is of course a crap invented by a bitter socialite few
> hundreds years after "Christ" to justify his sleeping around and
> uncontrolled drinking.
>
> And the last - the big nations may go murderous and the next morning all
> they have to say - "oh ****", the small one usually pay the full price.
> If not become a footnote in the history books.
>
> VM.
>
>
>
>
>
> >> The 1917 election results indicate more sup****t for Bolshevism
> >> in Livonia than almost anywhere in Russia proper. I don't see how
> >> that's licking ass -- or are you disputing the basic Russian line
that
> >> "Bolshevism was Jewish brains and Latvian muscles"? Do you think it's
> >> weird that a massive but rather educated underclass and large numbers
> >> of the landless sup****ted a revolutionary movement? I don't.
>
> > Sure, but in Latvia this movement was Bolshevik, particularly. =A0In
> > Ukraine the m***** sup****ted anti-Bolshevik Petliura, various
> > warlords, the anarchist Makhno, etc. and in Russia the m***** weren't
> > pro-Bolshevik either.
>
> >> It's more interesting to discuss what happened to that movement here
> >> -- how quickly it lost popularity after it had to put its money where
> >> its mouth was. Destroying the Russian Empire, in my opinion, was a
> >> lovely thing. The Czar deserved it.
>
> > What about the democratic government? =A0The Bolsheviks didn't
overthrow=

> > the czar, you know. =A0They just murdered him and his family.
>
> > Was the Provisional government so awful that Russia deserved to have
> > the Bolshevik regime replace it?
>
> >> Akuraters wrote a fine book about the Red Riflemen, in which he asked
> >> how they would face their mothers. But they -- Akuraters included --
> >> did do that, you see, and built a rather nice country in the bargain.
>
> > Sure, the Latvians forced a regime on the Russian and Ukrainian people
> > that was far, far worse, than what had ever been done to their own
> > people, and washed their hands of it, living happily for about 20
> > years. =A0Unfortunately the consequences of that crime came back to
them=

> > and their people.
>
> > regards,
>
> > BM- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
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