On 11 Maijs, 14:13, MTRP(tm) <Mir.Topol...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
> Eugene Holman wrote:
> > Peteris Cedrins wrote:
> > > Eugene Holman wrote:
> > > [snip]
> > > > The two protracted wars that the United
> > > > States has been waging in Afghanistan and Iraq have produced
nothing=
> > > > tangible
> > > No?
> > > 1. The Afghan Army is growing in size, experience, and leader****p
> > > capabilities.
> > Yes, it can now ensure that the government controls Kabul and some of
it=
s
> > suburbs, at least by day.
> > > 2. A recent study found that 90% of the Afghan population trusted
> > > the countries military force.
> > I'm not sure what such a survey or such statistics mean in a country
lik=
e
> > Afghanistan.
> > > 3. More than 4,000 km of roads have been built where only 50 km
> > > existed in 2001.
> > Modenr armies don't travel on camelback, so the infrastructure
building =
is
> > not altruism but self interest.
> > > 4. The rehabilitation of the North-East power system has advanced
> > > and access of the rural households to electricity has been
> > > significantly increased.
> > Being that Afghanistan was living essentially in the Middle Ages, one
> > percent would be a "significant increase".
> > > 5. In 2007 alone, ISAF nations completed 1,080 civil-military
> > > cooperation (CIMIC) projects.
> > The conventions of diplomacy require the "civil" to come before the
> > "military", but in actual life it is often the reverse.
> > > 6. 2,000 schools were built or repaired in the last five years
and
> > > around 6.4 million children (including 1.5 million girls) are now in
> > > schools.
> > This is an undeniable accomplishment, although one would expect the
numb=
er
> > of girls to be approximately 3.2 million. Much obviously remains to be
> > done.
> > > 7. Since 2001, both infant and under-five mortality has declined
by=
> > > 26% and 22% respectively.
> > The stats are still dreadful, though. According to the CIA World
Factboo=
k
> >
(https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/rankorder..=
..),
> > Afghanistan, with the world's third worst infant mortality rate, takes
t=
he
> > bronze medal in this sorry league.
> > > 8. In 2001, 8% of Afghans had access to some form of healthcare.
> > > Now more than 80% of the population has access to medical care.
> > Perhaps the American Republican Party can learn something from this.
> > > 9. The non-opium economy has grown at an average of 12% over the
> > > past four years; the number of poppy-free provinces has grown from
six=
> > > in 2006 to 13 in 2007.
> > That would probably have happened without the war.
> > > 10. Afghan public sup****t for international involvement in
> > > Afghanistan remains high with around 70% of Afghans sup****ting the
> > > presence of international forces.
> > I would suggest being critical about such statistics. People from the
> > Baltic countries in particular know that it is not a wise idea to
compla=
in
> > in public about their country being occupied when asked by
representativ=
es
> > of the occupiers.
> > > 11. The majority of Afghans believe their country is going in the
> > > right direction and 84% sup****t their current government (as opposed
> > > to 4% who would sup****t the Taliban).
> > I am certainly no fan of the Taliban, but I am highly sceptical of
these=
> > figures.
> > > 12. They also maintain a positive view of reconstruction efforts
> > > with 63% saying that reconstruction efforts in their area have been
> > > effective since 2002.
> > This I can understand.
> >
>http://www.americanthinker.com/2008/04/the_afghanistan_success_story_..=
..
> > For a less optimistic *****sment, see
> >http://www.spiegel.de/international/germany/0,1518,534467,00.html
>
> And here an obvious clue to americanthinker(s):http://tinyurl.com/6cvdkm
> Der Spiegel is also being doctored though. But luckily enough we've
> got Peter Scholl-Latour, aka westwide best expert on Islam,
> Afghanistan, Iran, Iraq & Co who's busy selling relevant & uncensored
> books (check out Amazon, et al).
>
> > I still stand by my position that the wars have been a colossal waste
of=
> > manpower and resources. The one thing that these conflits teach us is
th=
at
> > modern technological warfare is not an effective strategy for dealing
wi=
th
> > these types of problems. The Americans should have learned that lesson
i=
n
> > Vietnam. The Soviets learned it in Afghanistan. The Russians have
> > prevailed in Chechnya only because the area was developed enough for
21s=
t
> > century warfare applied in the most brutal possible manner,
accompanied =
by
> > massive propaganda to an educated populace as well as by influential
> > locals willing to collaborate, to make the freedom fighters/insurgents
> > understand that they really had something to lose.
>
> > Violence is not the strategy for dealing with problems seemingly
emanati=
ng
> > from the poorest and least developed areas of the world.
>
> > The returns for more than five years of protracted warfare in
Afghanista=
n
> > and Iraq, with Iran evidently next on the hit-list, have been
surprising=
ly
> > modest. Ubama bin-Ladin still survives. The Taliban is arguably not
only=
> > bigger, stronger, and more respected, but also controls a larger area
an=
d
> > influences more people than at any time in its history. Compare that
wit=
h
> > the fate of the Nazis five years after they overstepped the line.
>
> > Regards,
> > Eugene Holman
Hey, my reaction was to a single phrase by Eugene --
> > The two protracted wars that the United
> > States has been waging in Afghanistan and Iraq have produced nothing
> > tangible
Using logic even MTRP must acknowledge -- my point is that there's
plenty that's _tangible_.
I very well know that Eugene will indulge in Homanesque howling
defending and/or ignoring Russia, Myanmar, Islamists, etc. to the end
of his days -- if this was 1938 or so,would he be explaining how Nazi
Germany is on the democratic path and Weimar meant chaos? Probably
not, because Gene, more than anybody I've ever met, is an unchanging
product of the _gaism=E7nas_his time. One worries about apples that
never rot.
Anyway, it's fascinating.
/P
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